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![Mark Samenfink (@MSamenfink) APR 06, 2015 11:46:29 Interesting, so if I take your meaning correctly, the fact that I'm a gamer means that I cant also be a life-long science fiction novel enthusiast regardless of how much I may enjoy the authorship of, say, Poul Anderson, Philip K D---, Frederick Pohl, C.J. Cherryh, Robert Heinlein, Orson Scott Card, Ben Bova, Kevin J Anderson, and I can keep going off the top o my head of books, both entertaining and life-changing, that I But I am also a Gamer. So one of these loves becomes invalidated by the other, and I must therefore constrain myself, both from acting to break an awards-monopolizing blacklisting clique in a medium I enjoy because I happen to enjoy another, but also from spreading that information to anyone else who may share the view that a small clique aligned with a single publisher should have free reign to control the outcome of said awards that claim to be predicated on genre, not intemal to said pu Well, it's an interesting hypothesis, people in large numbers who dont like sci-fi bothering to nominate books they've never read for an award that means nothing to them in vast numbers. Let's test it! Here is a measurement (solely on twitter, not including data from KIA, 8chan, or FJ) of Gamergate's numbers with clearly defined metrics His conclusion appears to be around 150,000 unique individuals, solely on twitter. By all means, check his work. Now, how many nominations were received this year for the Hugo awards? 2,122.[1] How many were there last year, prior to the existence of Gamergate and any of the information sharing evidence you presented? 1,923.[2] Assuming the only difference is Gamergate's existence, between those years, that's 199 people Gamergate can on the fly force a hashtag to trend intenationally, like today with #GamergateArtCrit, what you would see, if we had organized people who didn't care about sci-fi rather than inform those who might, the numbers difference would have been in the tens of thousands Citations REPLY 員Jim C. Hines APR 06, 2015 13:04:42 "Interesting, so if I take your meaning correctly..." You don't. Your three paragraphs have nothing to do with anything being said or discussed here The rest seems to be a "Not All GamerGaters!" argument that ignores the evidence of the Sad/Rabid Puppies deliberately reaching out to get folks from GamerGate on board, as well as people in GamerGate doing the same. Yes yes, not all GamerGaters. But enough to significantly affect Mark Samenfink (MSamenfink) APR 06, 2015 22:28:25 "You don't. Your three paragraphs have nothing to do with anything being said or discussed re After stating this, you re-affirmed my point, which is that you are implying any and all people who happen to have mailed in a nomination AND to be involved with Gamergate sent their nominations under illegitimate pretenses, as though they cannot be fans of more than 1 recreational pursuit Further, I find it interesting that you characterize my argument as a "Not All GamerGaters!" (a misnomer, GamerGate is a scandal and a hashtag, not an identity) argument. My argument isnt "Not All" it's "None". Even if we were to assume the best possible scenario for your argument, that the small increase in number of nominations this year is entirely people involved in GG, all 199 of them, and were to also assume that the twitter presence of 150,000 people represents 100% of us (Not even close to true), this would mean that 0.0013% of us sent in a nomination. This best-case scenario for your argument cannot account for any claims regarding motive for those people, however since the number is so incredibly small even in these conditions that some strong motivation must have been required compared to the vast numbers that did not At no time did those of us involved in GamerGate organize any operation with any title to take any meaningful action regarding these awards. If we had, even a participation (still assuming smallest possible active numbers of us, based on the data from only twitter) of 1.5%, we would have more than doubled the number of nominations received. I'm telling you, on no uncertain tems, that the small increase to this year's voting, in your best case scenario, is the result of awareness nominations can even be made being granted to only the most die-hard of Sci-Fi writing fanatics, who then cared enough to do so on their own recognizance TL: DR If the few of us who care about Sci-Fi enough to participate in this when we found out our voices could be heard, Daddy Warpig and Myself among that number, had wanted to muddy the purity of the Hugo awards, we would have organized an operation to do so listing all steps so that even people who dont read sci-fi or even care could be spoon-fed the feeling of activism without any initiative required. The result would have been more nominations than the total received for every year the Hugo awards have existed combined](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/list/000/944/747/ff6.png "Mark Samenfink Explains The Facts About The GamerGate-SadPuppies Connection")
Top Comments
TheGamerGrim
Jan 13, 2015 at 03:35AM EST
The Ultimate Paragon
Jan 13, 2015 at 04:50PM EST